Find the perfect price point<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n You might not need to spend on marketing<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n You don\u2019t need e-commerce experience<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n You can\u2019t do it all \u2013 putting your trust in others isn\u2019t easy, but it is essential<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Overcome Christmas chaos with preparation <\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n This is what happens if you grow too fast to forecast<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n There is nothing wrong about asking for payments upfront<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Take the leap to get into a warehouse <\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n When should you make your small side project your full-time job<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Adapting and innovating are key to keeping your business relevant <\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Turning over a million doesn\u2019t make you a millionaire \u2013 so what do you pay yourself?<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Prioritise the welfare of your staff<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n How to maintain a healthy work life balance when running your own business<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Paving the way for women in business<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Business bloopers \u2013 learn and laugh from them<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Take time to celebrate your own milestones <\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Count your blessings and always stay positive<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n Today on Sound Advice, get year one in business right, we meet a woman who created a mail order business from her home with zero budget, and hit \u00a31m in turnover in just five months.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s right, Natalie Bamford and her husband created Colleague Box while on furlough and thought they\u2019d sell 7,000 boxes in their first year.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Instead, they sold 100,000.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Before we get stuck into how she did it, a little reminder that this series was created by the software powerhouse that is Sage. Sage helps small business owners with big dreams, just like Natalie.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Now, back to the startup tale.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So, Natalie, wow. What a phenomenal first year in business you\u2019ve had.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Thank you for taking time out to come and talk to us about it, because I imagine you are still frantic. How are you? Where are you? What\u2019s been going on?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Frantic is a good word. It\u2019s just been crazy.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And honestly, if I think about it too much, what\u2019s happened in this last year, it can actually be quite overwhelming.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I literally have to take every day as it comes.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Although we started in our home, in a little spare room, we are now in our warehouse, which we call the Smile Factory. It is a working warehouse so apologies for any background noise.<\/p>\n\n\n\n No, it\u2019s amazing. We\u2019re right in the thick of it and I can see behind you all those colours. You\u2019ve got pinks, greens, blues and oranges. It looks really dynamic and fun there. So I\u2019m getting the vibes.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Do you want to just explain to our listeners, what is a Colleague Box?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So a Colleague Box, it\u2019s a gift box that you can send one of, or one to your entire team or your entire company.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it\u2019s a gift box that is delivered directly to their door or office or workplace and the contents can vary.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s mainly food, drink, alcohol, nice things that put smiles on people\u2019s faces, but ultimately it can be anything basically.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And the idea, the whole ethos behind what we do, is we deliver happiness. So it\u2019s just about putting smiles on people\u2019s faces.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And what made you set up this business?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because I mean, I\u2019m a complete outsider, but I would presume that mail-order gifts have been around forever. People send hampers, people can send gifts. There\u2019s loads of companies doing that already.<\/p>\n\n\n\n What are you doing that\u2019s so radically different and what makes it so perfect for your teammates?<\/p>\n\n\n\n The first time we sent out a gift box, it was actually to our own colleagues, and it wasn\u2019t necessarily meant to be a business. It was just something nice to do for our colleagues at the start of the pandemic.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And the brief was basically to, and I keep harping back to this, Bex, I do apologise, but it\u2019s to put smiles on people\u2019s faces. And you\u2019re never going to please everyone.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So the contents we chose had sweets in there, some chocolate, and a little tiny bit of alcohol for those that wanted it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And so no one\u2019s expecting this, and it had a message inside from our CEO that just said, \u201cLook, I know this is a really difficult time that we\u2019re going through. We\u2019ll all be together soon.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n Obviously, we thought it was going to be sooner than it is but, \u201cWe\u2019re going to be together soon. Thank you for being on furlough. Thank you for working from home<\/a>.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n And basically it was low cost, but high quality.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So yeah, the hampers are out there and they\u2019re gorgeous and brilliant and extravagant. But, for someone wanting to send to their entire workforce, their entire team, there wasn\u2019t actually anything that fit the bill.<\/p>\n\n\n\n There wasn\u2019t anything that was just perfect.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So therefore we had to create it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So that\u2019s the really smart thing, that you actually found the right price point.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because if you\u2019re sending something to your mate at work, it\u2019s different from your best friend who you might send a \u00a3150 hamper to.<\/p>\n\n\n\n You want something for around \u00a320 and you want it to be really easy for them to access, so it has to go through their letter box, you don\u2019t want to send them to the post office.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So you\u2019ve combined all of these little unique points into something that\u2019s really, really powerful.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah, we think so.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And then obviously the initial feedback was really great and that just helped us to spiral and build on what, essentially, became a new business for us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And then, from that, we\u2019ve listened to the feedback.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we do now have bigger gifts. We do have more expensive gifts because people were saying, \u201cWell, I love these \u00a313.99- \u00a320 mark, but I actually want to spend a little bit more because it\u2019s a special occasion or someone\u2019s moving house or etcetera.\u201d So we\u2019ve gone, okay, no problem.<\/p>\n\n\n\n The lovely thing about being a small business<\/a> is that we can pivot and move quite quickly, and it\u2019s good to go and ready to buy within 24 hours, if not sooner. Because we like to listen. We are a new business, and we are for people.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And if we don\u2019t listen to what is needed and what\u2019s wanted, we are not going to go very far.<\/p>\n\n\n\n There\u2019s great advice.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And how did you go then from sending some boxes, putting together some boxes for your old employer, to then actually creating a business that is sending stuff for individuals and other companies? Because that\u2019s quite a big jump.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It was. And, as I say, when we sent out those first 76 boxes to our colleagues, we didn\u2019t really anticipate then moving into our warehouse and having sent over 100,000 boxes.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So it\u2019s a bit crazy really.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But I suppose the initial thing was that we sent them to a company who heard about what we did. We\u2019d worked closely with them as a business. They heard about what we did and said, \u201cCan we have some for our team who are on furlough?\u201d No problem. And they did a press release for us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So, they did a press release that obviously got us out there a little bit more, more people heard about us, they said, \u201cI love this idea. Can we order some?\u201d And it literally just snowballed from there. And I think we knew we were on to something when we didn\u2019t actually have to do any outward marketing.<\/p>\n\n\n\n People were coming to us and saying, \u201cI love these gift boxes. Can we get involved somehow in this?\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we just said, \u201cYeah, absolutely. We\u2019ll create things for you.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we started with one box only on our website. We only offered one thing and it was called the Colleague Box. And I think we have over 60 in the collection now.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But the majority of boxes we do are actually bespoke.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So people say, \u201cI like this as an idea. I\u2019d like this from that box, this from that box, and also can we put some of these things of ours in the box?\u201d We say, \u201cYeah, you know what? Absolutely.\u201d We\u2019re happy to make things bespoke because not one size fits all, does it?<\/p>\n\n\n\n That sounds enormously complicated.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I\u2019m going to come back to that and the logistical realities of doing something like that. But first you said that your first external customer put a press release out about you. So were they a media company? Was that just good fortune?<\/p>\n\n\n\n They were like, \u201cOh hey, actually we\u2019ll tell people that we know, or we\u2019ll create this piece of marketing material for you.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n How on earth did that happen?<\/p>\n\n\n\n They were a football club. So they\u2019ve obviously got their own marketing team.<\/p>\n\n\n\n They put a press release together for us, which went out on their website and things like that. And obviously to their fans, who potentially are business owners that want to send to their own colleagues.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And obviously we do individual orders. So there\u2019s no minimum order. So if you just want to send one to one particular person and, I shouldn\u2019t say this, but it doesn\u2019t even have to be a colleague, we can cater for that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So that\u2019s how word got out initially.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And so did you have any grounding in e-commerce before you started this business? What were you doing at your previous employee?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Am I right? It was sort of an HR and financial tech business? Because that\u2019s quite a far cry from mail order.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah. It\u2019s a technology business and I was just basically an admin assistant. I\u2019ve got a little one, so I worked part-time and just did admin. So, it\u2019s absolutely completely out of my comfort zone.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Both Adam and myself have never done anything like it before. It\u2019s been the biggest learning curve we\u2019ve ever been through, I think, personally and career wise, it\u2019s every day we learn something new.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So what did you have to learn? Break it down for me.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Did you have to build your own website, do your own social media, work out your own online shop?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Break down the biggest barriers to making this work, that you had to just fill your brains with all this information in order to move forward.<\/p>\n\n\n\n What were the pieces?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So, first and foremost, we knew that the best tool for marketing at this point was going to be social media.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I had to get my head around that to come up with a brand voice, which is basically me. Because I thought I\u2019m not experienced enough to go, okay, this is how we need to sound, this will be the tone.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I thought, I love these boxes and I\u2019m very passionate about what we\u2019re doing, what we\u2019re trying to achieve.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I think if I can get that through via our social media, then that will be fine. And to be honest, all the way through I thought, I\u2019ll just do it for now until we can get someone better.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s our press releases and award submissions and things, I\u2019m like, I\u2019ll just do this until we can get someone better in.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And actually the more you do it, the more you think, I\u2019m not so bad at this after all.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Coming up with the actual contents as well, we were nowhere near a wholesale size when we first started.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And if you remember when we weren\u2019t allowed into supermarkets, you had to queue outside. So poor Adam got the short straw and had to go and queue outside supermarkets to get supplies in. So that was a big obstacle.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019m trying to think now, I mean it was only a year ago, but it seems like an absolute lifetime ago. I think when we took on a team of our own as well, that was a massive learning curve.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Also the sense of responsibility really kicked in at that point, because you were thinking, if this goes wrong, it\u2019s not just myself and my husband that go, \u201cOh well, we gave it a try.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n You\u2019re responsible for someone else paying their bills and things like that. I think we quickly realised that we couldn\u2019t do it all and that we needed to get help in, such as an accountant<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Adam was trying to do all the books himself and last Christmas was just crazy. He said, we are going to end up falling behind and the last thing we want to do is get in trouble with HMRC as a new business. We need to do things properly. So it was just about spotting what are we good at? And what can we take on ourselves? What are we not so good at? What do we need help with?<\/p>\n\n\n\n And how did you go about finding that accountant?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because it\u2019s quite a big step to trust someone with the financials of your business. So I imagine it was quite a frightening, exciting, but frightening prospect.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah, absolutely. Like you say, it\u2019s that trust aspect, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I think, when you\u2019re doing everything yourself, you go, well, if it\u2019s not done right, at least it\u2019s only my fault. It\u2019s that trust element.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s really tricky, I felt that even, not just the accountant, but even taking someone on to help pack the boxes and put the content together was a massive step.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because we\u2019d just done that all ourselves and it was just, oh, hold on.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But what if they don\u2019t put everything in? What if it\u2019s not right? Let\u2019s get the training in place and then it can\u2019t go wrong and if it does, it\u2019s still on us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So the accountant we\u2019ve found. We\u2019re based in Derby, it\u2019s part of our Derby network and we were connected through LinkedIn and things like that. I saw that what they were doing, and I think they were relatively new as well at the same time as us, which is maybe a good thing, maybe a bad thing, but we\u2019re happy with everything today.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I think we went through a local accountant that had been used by the people that we knew and worked out the trust element that way. I guess you don\u2019t know until you try sometimes, do you?<\/p>\n\n\n\n But that\u2019s how we found them.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Did you have to speak to lots of accountants or was it just more about making one very strategic move, having seen that she worked with people that you knew, that she was trusted by people within your network and then just go bang?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah. That\u2019s what we did.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And on hindsight, we\u2019ve done that a few times and it\u2019s probably not the best way to do things, but I think we\u2019ve\u2026<\/p>\n\n\n\n You\u2019ve been lucky.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I guess so. Yeah.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s part of startup life sometimes. You have to go on gut instincts and your feel about people.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But I understand that you look back and think, \u201cOh, I should have approached that slightly more empirically, in hindsight.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n Absolutely. Yeah.<\/p>\n\n\n\n You mentioned there that it was around Christmas that you hit a crunch time. I\u2019ve seen a little something on my Googling adventures about you, that there was kind of a Christmas gate moment.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Tell me about Christmas gate?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we\u2019d taken on an order of 23,000 for one company, who were sending to their entire workforce, which was amazing. They were bespoke advent boxes.<\/p>\n\n\n\n They had 12 gifts in each that had to be put in the correct order because on the flip side of the box, it had a little riddle that related.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So, it wasn\u2019t a case of chuck them in. Not that we ever do this! Chuck them in and off they go. They had to be placed specifically in the right places. So that was the 23,000 order.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We also had around about 14,000 other orders. So corporate orders of various sizes, some were thousands, some were tens, twenties and hundreds. It was chaotic, and it was crazy.<\/p>\n\n\n\n To say we were under prepared is an understatement.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But having said that, looking back, I guess you look back with rose-tinted glasses, but you think, gosh, it was crazy, but it was brilliant. We loved every minute.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I think at one point we had 65 people helping us. I drafted in lots of family members. It was stressful and it was crazy, and we learned a heck of a lot from that experience, probably from those two months.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it really helped us move on as a business.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Had you sorted out your wholesale sorting or was Adam there with his trolley, raising eyebrows in Asda, as he cleared out the whole tiny gin, miniature gin bottle aisle?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Luckily, we did have wholesale suppliers sorted by that point, thank goodness.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And talk to me then about growth.<\/p>\n\n\n\n What do you have to consider when your business massively outstrips the growth that you had forecasted for it?<\/p>\n\n\n\n See, that\u2019s the thing. I don\u2019t know if we even forecast for it. To say we hit the ground running is an understatement.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We didn\u2019t have time to sit and think about forecast and cash flow<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It was just, these are the orders, this is what we need to get in, this is what we need to create on this day, this many boxes, this is where we need to ship them to.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It was in the sort of January that we thought, okay, now we\u2019ve got some breathing space. Let\u2019s formulate a plan.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Maths has always been my Achilles heel, so I massively lean on Adam for that side of things. I\u2019m more of the creative, the marketing, and the words, I can do that part.<\/p>\n\n\n\n The numbers I\u2019m not so great at. That\u2019s definitely Adam\u2019s part. It shouldn\u2019t be, but I suppose that\u2019s how we work well as a team.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah. It\u2019s good to have complementary skills. And then with that growth, I mean, I suppose the cash flow element.<\/p>\n\n\n\n You get paid when the order comes in, right? So you get paid upfront, which must make things a bit easier?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, no, we don\u2019t actually.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we\u2019re on a 30-day payment terms, which makes things tricky.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because we\u2019ve obviously already bought the stock and we\u2019ve got the team in to create the boxes. So we\u2019ve already got the cost of staff and overheads and things like that, because that\u2019s just the way it\u2019s been.<\/p>\n\n\n\n People just say, \u201cWell, this is our payment terms.\u201d And I guess, in our infancy, we just went, \u201cOkay, that\u2019s fine.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n Whereas now we\u2019re thinking, hold on, would you actually pay for something after you\u2019ve had it, or do you pay it on order?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we\u2019re starting to go, okay, the ones that we\u2019ve already done it for, that\u2019s fine. They\u2019re returning customers, that\u2019s what they expect.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But moving forward, we really need to think about, as you mentioned, cash flow and I don\u2019t think there\u2019s anything wrong with asking for payment first.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Especially because you are an established business now.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So maybe when you are brand new and you haven\u2019t been around very long, you have a little leeway where you\u2019re saying, \u201cRight, I\u2019ll deliver the product and then you pay me.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n But now you\u2019ve got a proven model.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It makes more sense to say, \u201cHey, we\u2019ve been doing this for a year. We\u2019ve not messed anything up. You can pay upfront.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah, I think you\u2019re right.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And when you decided to move into your first warehouse, I mean, where do you start?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Is there like a findawarehouse.com? How did you move out of your home and make that leap?<\/p>\n\n\n\n We had to. So we set up in the May and then I think it was either June or July that we took the order for 21,000 Halloween boxes with actual pumpkins inside, real-life pumpkins.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Although our house was actually resembling a warehouse anyway, we thought there\u2019s no way we can do this from home. So it was all hands to the pump.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And again, this is where I was saying, perhaps we could have had three options and weigh them all up, but we just had to move really, really fast.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So it was July, sort of August time that we set on the hunt.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Once we\u2019d had this order confirmed, we set on the hunt for a space. We happened to find it fairly quickly. I think it was about six weeks in total from actually finding it to getting the keys and moving in.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We moved in on the 8th of September last year, ready for the first order of boxes, first and foremost. Then the pumpkins started to arrive mid-September, to pack and put out.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it\u2019s kind of nice because, without that portion, that catalyst, would we have made the leap or would we have remained, oh well, this is just ticking along nicely as a little side project?<\/p>\n\n\n\n No, I was going to say, was that a tipping point as well to leave your previous jobs?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Or had you already done that?<\/p>\n\n\n\n No. So I started Colleague Box full time in the August and Adam started in the October.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we had a couple of months where obviously we were doing the two roles, which was tricky. Because you want to give your best to both. One\u2019s stable and secure and good, and the other one is new but exciting. Where could it go?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So it was making that, again, that leap almost of going, look, let\u2019s give it all and see what happens. And then, if it doesn\u2019t work out, least we can say we tried and gave it our best shot.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because you\u2019re sort of all in when you get a warehouse, because before that you are such a lean business and then suddenly a warehouse is a massive overhead.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So how did you adjust to that? Because did you have to raise your prices as well?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because suddenly that\u2019s a big bill to pay.<\/p>\n\n\n\n No, we didn\u2019t want to do that because we are all about affordability and you could go anywhere and get a really expensive gift.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s kind of what we thought sets us apart, that and the personalisation.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we didn\u2019t want to start raising prices because it\u2019s not the consumer\u2019s fault that we\u2019ve moved into a warehouse. So why should they be punished, really?<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it just meant that we had to up a gear in terms of, I think, like you said, that we take it seriously now. We\u2019ve got the space, let\u2019s get a team. It\u2019s not just me and Adam anymore. It\u2019s not just us working from home.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Let\u2019s make the most of this because we didn\u2019t know how long it was going to last.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It was very much a Covid business, that boxes were being used for a variety of reasons, virtual events and online things mainly, because we were still in lockdown.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we were just thinking, we need to just make the most of this while we can.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And as we come out of lockdown, how do we stay in the forefront of people\u2019s minds? Because people are still wanting to buy gifts and send positivity and joy through the post to each other, whether they\u2019re working from home or back in the office.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But yeah, that did turn it up a notch in terms of the seriousness of, okay, let\u2019s go for this now.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I\u2019m going to be a real meanie, but I want to ask you about this whole Covid effect because when we were all\u2026<\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, I work from home anyway, but when whole companies are working from home, the idea of a Colleague Box makes absolute sense.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But if, in a year\u2019s time say, and there\u2019s lots of big ifs in this question, but if everyone is back in the office in a year, do you think that Colleague Box would maintain the kind of growth that you\u2019ve seen thus far?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah, I think so.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And we are working on different things in the background, more experiences and things like that, and even subscriptions.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So we\u2019ve just launched an office subscription box whereby you can get your box of snacks delivered for the workplace.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So even though things are changing, we can adapt quite quickly and innovate and change with them. There\u2019s always going to be a need for corporate gifting.<\/p>\n\n\n\n There has been, there was before the pandemic, and I think that will continue through.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So it\u2019s just about staying fresh, new, innovative, and in the forefront of people\u2019s minds.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We\u2019ve got a lot of returning customers, which is brilliant, that have gone back to normal. Let\u2019s say gone back to the office, but they\u2019re still wanting to use the gift boxes to celebrate company milestones or colleague\u2019s birthdays.<\/p>\n\n\n\n There\u2019s still reasons and it\u2019s a lovely, I don\u2019t like the word staff, but a staff perk or reward.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So moving away from Covid and the pandemic, there\u2019s still very much a need for them.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I think, as long as we can keep our boxes fun, exciting, memorable, something that people actually want to receive, I hope, and this may be me just being overly positive, that there\u2019ll still be a need for colleague boxes way into the future when we\u2019ve said goodbye to Covid.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Now, you\u2019ve convinced me. I\u2019m thoroughly on board.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I love the idea of the subscription where it\u2019s not just a one-off gift or actually it\u2019s the gift that keeps giving. I can imagine that being a real hit. It\u2019s great that you are able to be so adaptable.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I think that means that yeah, however hybrid working, whatever\u2019s coming, however all these changes manifest, you\u2019ll be able to adapt the business to suit it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Some people might see that your business turns over \u00a31m and think that that makes you and your husband millionaires.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it\u2019s always useful to actually point out that is so far from the case, because it\u2019s actually quite tricky to extract any sort of personal benefit from a company.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I know you said you\u2019re not that au fait with figures so just say skip if this isn\u2019t the question for you, but how do you do it? Do you have a salary and then a dividend?<\/p>\n\n\n\n How do you make any money from this thriving business that you\u2019ve created?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yes. It\u2019s a funny point because I had a friend text me out the blue when I\u2019d been in the paper and the headline was, \u201cMum makes \u00a31million.\u201d And she texted me and said, \u201cAre you a millionaire?\u201d Just came right out with it, no beating around the bush.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Sadly had to say, absolutely not. That\u2019s not the case at all.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Makes for a great headline though. So yeah, it\u2019s a salary and then dividends, but there have been times where we\u2019ve gone, it\u2019s not right for the business to have the dividends at this time and that\u2019s fine.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We are in it for the long haul and that\u2019s just the way it goes sometimes, isn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019ve listened to a couple of podcasts with the Moonpig founder, and Holly Tucker, Not On The High Street. And I think they went through similar things.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And you think if we, I\u2019m not saying we\u2019re going to be the next Not On The High Street or the next Moonpig, but you think it\u2019s nice to know that a company that is so successful and has been around for so long, went through similar things as we are.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s kind of comforting in a way that you go, well, we\u2019re not the only ones and it\u2019s not because we\u2019re doing something massively wrong. It\u2019s just cash flow and things like that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I think it\u2019s normal. That\u2019s what I\u2019m telling myself anyway.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So you basically have to look at the cash position of the business and think how much should I really be paying myself this month?<\/p>\n\n\n\n As long as I can make all my staff salaries. You are always going to be the ones that pull the short straw, I suppose?<\/p>\n\n\n\n 100%. Yeah, exactly. Because they are our priority.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We need to make sure we can pay our own bills, keep a roof over our children\u2019s heads but yeah, you\u2019ve absolutely hit the nail on the head that we always make sure that our team are sorted first and foremost.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019d like to talk about your kids.<\/p>\n\n\n\n You say you\u2019ve got a toddler and a teenager, which is like, oh my goodness. Probably the most stressful combination I can imagine. So how\u2026<\/p>\n\n\n\n Did I mention that we have a puppy?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Oh my goodness. You are a sucker for punishment.<\/p>\n\n\n\n How do you juggle it all with a fast-growing business, two kids and a puppy? What gives and what kind of support do you have in place to help you manage everything?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So the lovely, lovely thing about being self-employed, or being the owner of the business, is that I can kind of choose my hours without putting pressure on anybody else.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I don\u2019t want anyone picking up where I\u2019ve left off. I make sure I do a really good job.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So at the moment, because my youngest is, well, she\u2019s just turned four. So I don\u2019t know if she\u2019s technically still a toddler, it\u2019s just sounds good, teen and toddler.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I still have two days when I\u2019m not in the office. I used to say when I\u2019m not working, but that\u2019s not technically true because I\u2019ll always answer emails and do social media and things like that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I have it where I\u2019m not in the office, which is our time. I\u2019m very conscious that coming up to school is around the corner.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So that time will be over. And I know how precious, obviously having the older one, I know how precious this time is and it goes super-fast.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So sometimes I\u2019m thinking I could really do with being in the office today. I\u2019ve just got this, I needed to get on top of that and it\u2019s do this. But I\u2019m just like, no. This is quality time with your child that they need at this stage.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And then equally I\u2019ll feel guilty when I\u2019m at work and think, oh, I really should spend more time with the children.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019ve always felt like this in whatever job I\u2019ve been in.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I don\u2019t think you can ever win, but it\u2019s lovely that I\u2019ve got that time. I think that\u2019s really important to keep that, even though it can be really tempting to go, I\u2019ll just pop her into preschool for another couple of days, and that means that I\u2019ve got more time to work.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I just think I\u2019d massively regret doing that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I can feel your frustration. I can feel it emanating out of you. Just the sort of, there just aren\u2019t enough hours in the day quandary.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah, exactly that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But it must be amazing with your older daughter to be this sort of go-getter, inspirational businesswoman.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Do you feel like she now sees more paths opening up ahead for her in her future? That she could be her own boss, just like you?<\/p>\n\n\n\n She has helped out here a few times, but she\u2019s not been massively interested, and I\u2019ve not taken offence at that because I\u2019m just her mum. I\u2019m never going to be cool.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s okay.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019m all right with that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But just recently I won an award, and it was \u2018East Midland businesswoman of the year\u2019. And she has been totally inspired by that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it\u2019s just made me beam with pride because she wrote down this massive list.<\/p>\n\n\n\n On the night that I won, I Facetimed her and said, \u201cI won, I can\u2019t believe it.\u201d And she wrote down this massive list in her notes of just all the things that she took from that, that she can apply to her own life.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it was like, always be yourself. And I was just almost in tears, listening to this, that I\u2019ve obviously created a little spark in her, which I\u2019m over the moon about.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And yeah, I think she\u2019s showing an entrepreneurial spirit actually, which I don\u2019t think is a bad thing.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I wish that she could learn a bit more about it in school because, as you know, it\u2019s not all, \u201cOh, you\u2019re your own boss, you can do what you want.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s like, well, yeah, but there\u2019s a lot of other things that come with that and a lot of responsibility. So it\u2019d be great if they taught more about it in schools.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But, for the effect that we are having on her, I\u2019m really pleased.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I\u2019d like to think that, if she did go down the path of starting her own business<\/a>, that she might come to us for some help or advice, or we could help along that journey.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s something that we didn\u2019t have. I guess you\u2019ve got to let them make their own path as well but, if we can help in any way, I\u2019d love to be part of that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I think it\u2019s about options really, isn\u2019t it? It\u2019s not about saying you should be this or you should be that, but it\u2019s about just showing that there\u2019s so many different things on the table.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Can you share any sort of hair-raising moments that you\u2019ve had with Colleague Box?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Any things that have gone wrong, spoiled pumpkins, or peanuts going to a peanut allergy sufferer. There must be so many wonderful tales that you could regale me with.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Oh, that\u2019s a good one. I mean, luckily, nothing too major.<\/p>\n\n\n\n For the 23,000 advent boxes that I mentioned, we were about, I want to say 1,000. It may have been more. Again, I\u2019m looking back with rose-tinted glasses.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Of one gift short, which meant Adam driving up to London on the day that they were meant to be picked up.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So they were all being picked up at the same time.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Driving to London to get 1,000 bags of the gift that we needed. And I think we had two hours to spare, and it was just crazy.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Because we were waiting for one gift, we couldn\u2019t then put the lids on, which meant we couldn\u2019t put them in the outer box, which means we couldn\u2019t put the label. So it was like a small cog, but in a big wheel.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And without it, the show couldn\u2019t go on.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So although 1,000 short, about 23,000, it doesn\u2019t seem that bad, but it was just\u2026 It was going to be catastrophic. And there was no other option.<\/p>\n\n\n\n You can\u2019t just pluck 1,000 gifts out of thin air, and they\u2019d all been signed off as you can imagine.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And, actually, bespoke.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Some of them that had bespoke packaging on and stuff. So it was just like, oh my gosh, what do we do?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So poor Adam drove up to London, got stuck in traffic on the way back. I think he got back at 9pm. The pickup was at 11pm and we were just all there filling.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And then another team were putting the boxes on, and I was just sat on the floor. And I just had a massive pile of address labels that I was just putting on.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I remember there was some other Christmas song, I think it was Merry Christmas Everyone. And I couldn\u2019t have been less in the festive spirit.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I almost wanted to say, \u201cCan someone switch that off?\u201d I thought, no, don\u2019t be the Grinch. Don\u2019t be the Grinch. But I was just sat on a cold floor in the warehouse.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I guess obviously that was crazy but also it was really, looking back, it was quite nice because it just meant everyone had to join in together. And it was about very massive team effort.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I will always try and find the positive in every situation.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I guess it was, although horrific, we did pull it out the bag just in time. And it was nice that we all came together to do that. So that was one.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And then, oh, actually on the same project, a couple of our gifts were held up in customs for two weeks. I think there was Santa hats and something else. Oh, some gloves. And so that meant we pushed just two weeks behind where we should have been, which was just a nightmare.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And then the delivery finally turned up.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We thought, yes. Okay. We\u2019ve got these gifts. We can move forward.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And he opened the van and just, it was quite comical really, all the boxes must have been opened by customs to see what was in them. And so they were quite split. And so he opened up his pilot, all these Santa hats just piled into the road.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It was the most surreal thing you\u2019ve ever seen in your life.<\/p>\n\n\n\n That\u2019s like slapstick comedy. You\u2019re expecting something Laurel and Hardy to tumble out with the Santa hats at this point.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Honestly. Sometimes you\u2019re just thinking, are we being filmed here? Is this going to be a \u2018gotcha\u2019 moment?<\/p>\n\n\n\n So that was just crazy. Touch wood, it\u2019s been quite plain sailing apart from those hiccups.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And when you made that 11pm pickup with all those advent calendars, did you celebrate?<\/p>\n\n\n\n I mean, do you have to take the time to really pat yourself on the back and thank your team when something like that, when you pull out the bag?<\/p>\n\n\n\n You know what? We\u2019re really bad at doing that, to be honest.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I don\u2019t know if that\u2019s just quite common in business owners that you\u2019re like, okay, that job\u2019s done and complete, what\u2019s the next task.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And actually what we should have done is gone, wow. What an achievement.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yes, we had hiccups. Yes, it could have gone smoother. But my God we\u2019ve learned a lot from it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n We definitely did thank the team. Over the next couple of days when it was just basically a mass tidy up preparation, but I don\u2019t think we did with each other, ever look back.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And it\u2019s the same with the pumpkin project. It was gruelling and really took its strain on us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I don\u2019t know if we ever really did go, oh, wow. Well done us. Little pat on the back. It was just like, okay, onto the next.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So that\u2019s probably something we need to really get better at, to be honest.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And even with the award that I mentioned, people saying, \u201cOh, how have you celebrated?\u201d And I was like, \u201cWell, I haven\u2019t. I\u2019ve just gone back to work.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n Well, maybe this is something that needs to come out of this podcast, is that you need to make a promise to yourself that you\u2019ll start celebrating these milestones and figuring out a way to make them stand out and to reward yourself in some way.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah. I actually really, definitely agree with that. I\u2019m on board. I\u2019m on board.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I\u2019ve got another question for you. So I mentioned my frantic Googling of you over the past couple of weeks, and I saw a really brief news article about you surviving a childhood illness and how that has shaped your outlook on life and on business.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Can you tell us a bit about that?<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah, absolutely.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So when I was 10, I contracted Meningococcal Meningitis, which saw me going into intensive care and the doctors gave me 48 hours to live.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Did the whole parents into the little room that you don\u2019t want to go in because, you know why.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And basically said, get anyone in here that needs say their goodbyes, really. Which, as a mum now, I can\u2019t imagine how tough that would\u2019ve been. I mean, I say I was fine, obviously I wasn\u2019t fine.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I was dying, but I was out of it. I didn\u2019t have a clue what was going on at that point. I was completely out of it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But I always just feel so sorry for my parents and family having to go through that, my older sister and it just must have been horrific. But I think this is why I always try and find the positive in things because really, I shouldn\u2019t be here.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So for me every day is a blessing. That sounds really cheesy, doesn\u2019t it?<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s cheesy but it\u2019s true. We should not be ashamed of cheesy. Cheesy is good.<\/p>\n\n\n\n No, but it is honestly.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And to be sat here and I look around and we\u2019ve got this business and I get to work with my husband every day and we\u2019ve got our team here and to think, I mean, not only did I survive Meningitis, which is really deadly, it\u2019s a real killer even now, which is such a shame.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But I could have been left with so many ongoing problems.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And I had Septicaemia, which I think is now called Sepsis. And that reached the top of my thighs. If that had gone past my hips, I would\u2019ve lost my legs.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It can have severe problems moving forward with your brain, with speech, with sight, hearing.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So honestly, I\u2019m super lucky. And I\u2019ve got glasses, but other than that, super lucky to be here.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It did affect my memory. So my memory is what I like to call \u2018shot to pieces\u2019.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I can\u2019t remember things. And this is what people find really sad, but, for me, it\u2019s just how I live. I can\u2019t remember my children being born. I can\u2019t remember my wedding day and holidays. And people go, \u201cI don\u2019t know how you can cope with that.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n But I had this when I was 10 and I\u2019m now 36. So it\u2019s kind of what I\u2019ve always known. I\u2019ve always known that I can\u2019t remember these things.<\/p>\n\n\n\n But the lovely thing about living in this new digital age is that I have them all to hand.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So with my wedding day, I can look back in my head and see still images. So I can\u2019t remember moving pictures, I can\u2019t remember walking down the aisle, but I remember the day because I\u2019ve looked at pictures enough times for them to be installed in my brain.<\/p>\n\n\n\n It\u2019s the same with milestones for my children.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So I won\u2019t remember what I\u2019ve done for their birthday last year, but I can have a look back at photos, oh yeah, that\u2019s it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And that will help things come back to me.<\/p>\n\n\n\n So, I guess I just take each day as it comes, and just try and see the positives in everything. Because, when you come that close to death, you just realise how lucky you are.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Yeah there\u2019s the memory issues, but I shouldn\u2019t be here and I am. I\u2019m here to tell the tale and, for me, that just means that every day, no matter how hard it gets or how tough it gets, at least I\u2019m here.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Natalie, you are so fabulous, and I\u2019ve thoroughly enjoyed every second chatting to you.<\/p>\n\n\n\n I could keep you here all day, but I can tell from the frenzied activity in the background that it\u2019s hotting up at the warehouse. So I\u2019m going to let you go but thank you so much for joining us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n No, thank you so much for having me. What an opportunity. I\u2019m overwhelmed.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Obviously, every opportunity that comes my way, I just feel totally blessed.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And thank you. I really, really do appreciate it. It\u2019s nice to tell the story.<\/p>\n\n\n\n To send your pals at work a little treat, head over to colleaguebox.co.uk<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n\n\n You can also find the lovely Natalie on Twitter @Natalie_OB.<\/p>\n\n\n\n If you were inspired by this episode, tell me. Tell me everything you loved, everything you wish I\u2019d asked. I\u2019m on Instagram at SparkyBex000.<\/p>\n\n\n\n And don\u2019t forget to tag in Sage and use the hashtag Sound Advice podcast. To find the show notes and lots of helpful guides around starting a mail-order business, head on over to sage.com\/podcast.<\/p>\n\n\n\n See you in two weeks for more Sound Advice.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Wherever you\u2019re listening or watching, subscribe to Sound Advice on Apple iTunes here.<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n We are also on Spotify and anywhere else you get your podcasts.<\/p>\n\n\n\n Join our community to share your insights and stories on Twitter @SageIreland<\/a> using the hashtag #SoundAdvicePodcast, on Instagram @SageOfficial or in the comments below!<\/p>\n\n\n\n And for more about Natalie Bamford, why not get involved in spreading some joy and follow @colleaguebox on Instagram<\/a>.<\/p>\n\n\n\nBex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
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One small act of kindness can become a booming business idea<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Find the perfect price point<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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You might not have to spend on marketing<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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You don\u2019t need e-commerce experience<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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You can\u2019t do it all \u2013 putting your trust in others isn\u2019t easy, but it is essential<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Overcome Christmas chaos with preparation<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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This is what happens if you grow too fast to forecast<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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There is nothing wrong about asking for payments upfront<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Take the leap to get into a warehouse<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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When should you make your small side project your full-time job<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Adapting and innovating are key to keeping your business relevant<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Turning over a million doesn\u2019t make you a millionaire \u2013 so what do you pay yourself?<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Prioritise the welfare of your staff<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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How to maintain a healthy work life balance when running your own business<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Paving the way for women in business<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Business bloopers \u2013 learn and laugh from them<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
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Bex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Natalie Bamford:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Take time to celebrate your own milestones<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
Bex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Natalie Bamford:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Bex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Natalie Bamford:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Count your blessings and always stay positive<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
Bex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Natalie Bamford:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Bex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Natalie Bamford:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Bex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Natalie Bamford:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Bex Burn-Callander:<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Inspired by this small business story?<\/h2>\n\n\n\n
![\"\"](\"https:\/\/www.sage.com\/en-ie\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/13\/2022\/04\/GettyImages-1222451249-1440x810.jpg\")
\t\t\t<\/div>\n<\/div>\n\n\n\n\n\n![\"\"](\"https:\/\/www.sage.com\/en-ie\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/sites\/13\/2021\/04\/z.5E3A0481_All-Uses.jpg\")
\t\t\t<\/div>\n<\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"